We still need a fully featured Linux desktop client to replace the one that hasn't been developed since (or was removed from) GroupWise 8!
by: Simon F. | over a year ago | Other
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Votes
245
Fully featured Linux desktop client
by: Simon F. | over a year ago | Other
Comments
+1 for this. If we have a supported Linux Desktop, why not a Linux GroupWise client?
It is a big shame that we are selling one of the best linux systems and the best groupware system and we don't have linux client. Many people are using linux because working on another platform is not efficient. And now on SLED 12 is using of GW8 linux client really big hell.
Either that, or make the web client so full featured that a native client is not necessary. If the web client can do all the Windows client can, then I think people will be okay with that, especially if it uses the many advanced functions of HTML5 to great effect.
I am not sure, if it is enough. Especially in cases when user does not have really fast internet connection is this unusable. Our office has symmetrical guaranteed 6Mbps connectivity and corporate web client is very slow.
That could be a challenge, sure. However it should be possible to make an offline version like has been done with Gmail with HTML5 local storage and the like, plus selective fetching of content so you don't load the full inbox/folder up front. I hope we get either the Linux Client or a vastly improved webclient that would work within your bandwith restrictions.
Alternately, move functionality out of the Windows client and onto the POA and MTA agents so that cross-platform functionality is easier to implement on all clients. And create a new SOAP-based Linux client along those lines.
Wouldn't Mono (http://www.mono-project.com/) be ideal for this? I'm not a developer but, one code base for all three, why not?
I think, we celebrated removing mono from SLES in the past. I remember, that first ZENworks 10 was using some mono apps and it was hell.
Not having a GroupWise client equal to the one our staff are used to having on a Windows machine wasn't the only (nor the biggest) barrier to moving our desktops to Linux but it was one and an 'own goal' one at that.
I appreciate it must be hard enough to keep the client up to speed developing for one platform let alone three (if Linux, why not Mac) but it's a shame you can't... and yes I've heard of the new 'compatible with ios apps' options for the mac users we have...
I would need a full working Linux GroupWise Client
Native Linux and Android Groupwise client is very important for transiting to Linux Desktop IT.
The simple way could be able run ZENWorks Aplication Virtualization with GroupWise on Linux
Not to have a native Linux client updated limits the quality of the product.
As a SysAdmin working with SuSe/Novell servers I prefer to use a Linux desktop (which is also what I use at home). We really need updated Linux Novell apps. I would love to not have to rely on web access for email but to use an updated client instead.
Like Consultor I migrate a lot of company desktops from Windows to Linux when Novell push this change, but now I have a comapnies at the past with GW Desktop 8 :(
Our GroupWise users needs native client for Linux and Mac, best available for GW2014 and GW2012.
Any update on this Idea?
Yes, at some weeks i voted on this item. I've several costumers, with several SLED, and is absolutely need a new gw 2012/2014R2 client for linux. At some years ago, Novell said to us, to sell SLEDs on the costumers, so, Novell should not abandon us now! Do Microfocus have some resolution about this idea? Thanks!
The only thing to get attention is to make a lot of noise; try to get a lot of people to vote on the these idea's.
Novell has tried to silently pull back on the support for Linux desktop. The Horrible GroupWise JAVA client for Mac and Linux scared most of us (and any early Linux desktop adopters) away. That, in my option, did not only hurt Linux desktop but also the OSX support story. Mind the lousy support with ZCM on Mac and the totally missing support for iPrint, Filr and Vibe on Linux desktop. For those on a SLED (I would say to just use LEAP now) device the're is a lack of upsell opportunities within this company. You FE have to turn to a 3th party for a good file sync solution, go figure.
Can anyone post numbers on the amount of Linux desktops in their company? Just that is needed to make up a good business case.
The radical turn around would be to add these workgroup and collaboration products (OES, GroupWise, Vibe, Filr, etc) in the SUSE business unit. And yes, open source and rebrand them. I believe THAT would create an opportunity for growth.
I totally agree with all your comments!. Like Consultant I migrated/suggested a lot of companies desktops from Windows to Linux. Now we have CEO's using MAC with old GWclients v8. :-(
Why cripple GroupWise by making it impractical for Mac laptops to use a current client? Everyone knows someone who uses a MacBook Air. GroupWise 8 just looks old.
Totally agree, need to update this old client.
Thanks
Agreed.
I NEED LINUX GROUPWISE CLIENT!!
update this old client!!
Thanks.
I Agree!!! Its time to Novell /Microfocus update the Linux Groupwise client! Suse Linux Desktop is not from one of the group enterprise?! If we have Linux Groupwise Client we could sell more SLED !!!
PJSS
I would settle at this point for an updated Evolution plugin or even an ActiveSync plugin for Evolution that would "play nicely" with Groupwise Mobility Service (Datasync)...
My manager attended a MicroFocus conference last night and asked about any future plans for an updated GroupWise client for linux. He was told that 'there were no plans for it because the linux market share is so small in comparison to Windows/OSX. They won't start developing until it becomes commercially viable for them.' Think we might be out of luck gentlemen.
That's not suprising. After more than year using SLED, I'm looking forward to get back to Slackware. I think, the quality of linux desktops causes the linux market viability.
I am said manager! Obviously with GroupWise 2014 R2 we have the option of CalDAV/CardDAV so you can use KMail, Thunderbird etc but it would still be good to get a native client again. I think we just need to keep banging on about this, and show that there is a market for it.
This is magic circle. Most of GroupWise extra features are on client side. So using Thunderbird makes GroupWise only common email system. CalDAV and CardDAV are necessary for Mac users. But this does not enable them to use archiving, backuping, server side rules etc, which native client does. And what I know from my colleagues is, that at the moment there is no plan for new native linux client. So this discussion does not make sense. Nothing will change despite the fact how much people are shouting "we want native linux client".
Shouting does not help, numbers do. So back to my comment of a month ago: can you ALL please post the amount and type of Linux desktop you need a client for? How do Windows/Mac/Linux numbers relate in your organization?
From a sales perspective, would you (or your customer) move to a Linux desktop case GroupWise would have a Linux Client? Would having a Linux desktop sell more licenses (do you have opportunities)?
On the topic of priorities, if you make a top 10 GroupWise feature list your organization needs, at what place would a Linux client be (so, not just for 'you' as an admin)?
Thinking out of the box:
The hardest part is maintaining a desktop client for multiple platforms, mind there are several desktop environments for Linux (Gnome, KDE, Unity,..). We've had this discussion for the iPrint and Filr client recently with success. So, my idea: if MF/Novell would as a start provides only the 'GroupWise engine' as an API that could be installed on Win/Lin/OSX platform, would it be possible a community stands up to create a GroupWise Nextgen-Cross-Platform Client? Or would someone be able to tie this into Evolution/Kmail/other and be able to add additional feature to Evolution/Kmail/other leveraging that API? Would it be even possible to create a GW Linux client that would satisfy all of you? I mean using a dev kit to create a GUI for KDE would possible look different using Gnome's dev kit. How about integration's with the desktops, other applications, etc. This is all a lot of work and you need the right people. To be honest, my personal opinion is that GW needs to be open sourced before those people would have interest in such a project. My vision is that an open GW client should turn into an addition to LibreOffice like what Outlook is for MS Office. That means such a client should not only work with GroupWise.
I'm thinking that Microfokus is kicking itself outside the mainstream of IT band wagon. If they say 'there were no plans for it because the linux market share is so small in comparison to Windows/OSX' its mean that they do not understood today IT trends. If Linux desktop share is to small, what they have to say about Android? Why we still do not have native Android Groupwise client? The had management of Microfocus definitely loose momentum for Linux Desktop. Microfokus bought Novell as only one enterprise grade Linux provider (OES/Gropwise/Vibe/iPrint/Flir). They are completely ignoring Linux Desktop. In next 5 year we will see massive Linux Desktop adoption based on Vmware and Cytrix visualization. They should take care on Android Desktop like ChromeOs or RemixOS. Microfocus take on Linix/Android Desktop band wagon again, do not burn Novell!!!
If no more willing to develop it, why dont they simply release the v.8 source code and give a chance to the community do continue its development?
While I appreciate the spirited debate and the passion behind the Linux desktop I do feel that I should provide a response. In the GroupWise space we do not have any current plans to develop a native Linux client. While you can never say never as the future is difficult to predict I do not see any changes to this in the foreseeable future.
what about getting the windows client working under wine? Would'nt that be less challenging than creating a new client for Linux/MAC. Everyone gets the same client.
Everyone, use Evolution with imaps, the Calendar Server and LDAP MTA System Address book. Works a treat! I'm using Ubuntu 15.10 with GroupWise 2014 R2 backend. This is the same way Novell/MF are supporting Mac clients natively. Just remember to set the Sent Mail folder to the GroupWise Sent Items folder.
To Novell, if you don't want to give us a native Linux client, then at the very least support Linux desktop the same way your supporting Macs.
Manoj - NDS8
We are a public adminsitration in Spain with more than 1400 Linux desktop computers (Zaragoza, Spain). Mainly we use Groupwise system with Thunderbird in client side but we need to use Groupwise in many cases. Groupwise Linux Client has a lots of lacks of funcionality if you compare with Windows version. If this situation persist we are considering to migrate to another mail system :-(
Unless MF has a large seat full-pay GW customer who is going to migrate because there is no Linux/Mac client, I don't see this happening. Development of a new client could take years and if there is no return on the investment they aren't going to do it.
MF would need to commit to building a new modular client that would form the basis of a new Windows as well as Mac/Linux client. This is the only way to sustain the costs of the client development i.e. share most of the code across all three. Again, with twenty plus years of code in the windows client, I don't see them starting over even if that's what should happen.
As for the Linux desktop share, it's tiny, and it's even smaller if you look for people who are both Linux desktop and GW customers. This gets even move complicated if you toss in EDU, non-profit, or full-pay customers. GW was once really big in EDU, and there is still a presence in K-12, but MF effectively gives away GW licenses to EDU. That is, I doubt there is enough revenue in the sector to justify development of either a Mac or Linux client.
On the webaccess front, Novell/MF spoke of WA feature-parity with the windows client going back as far as 1998 and GW 5.5, but it's never happened. If it's not happened in 18 years, I'm not sure it will ever get there. They new architecture makes it more likely but there are new features being added to the Windows client and they are not automatically being added to WA.
On the mobile clients, we started with the idea that the built-in client was enough but then users figured out they needed a full-featured client even on a mobile device. Others reacted e.g. Oulook for iOS/Android or the Gmail client, but MF is still in the basic functionality is more than enough mindset. I'm really surprised that they haven't licensed/acquired Ghostpattern's product. No shame in that - MS did that to get the foundation of their mobile Outlook client.
If MF is unwilling to commit the resources to upgrading the existing GW8 mac client (I wouldn't expect them to build one from scratch), then they should just release the code to the open-source community. It would probably be fixed in a few months.
My guess is that it could be difficult to open-source the code as is contains other licensed software. They actually produced a slightly updated version of the client and then removed it because of a licensing issue. The client also started life at another company, so I'm not sure if that's a barrier or not.
How about running the native GroupWise "Wasatch" Windows client via CrossOver on the Mac OS and Linux OS?
See https://www.codeweavers.com/compatibility/crossover/groupwise-2014
Micro Focus can leverage the Porting Process that is offered at
https://www.codeweavers.com/porting/process
I have previously stated that I do appreciate the debate and the passion around the products. I do disagree with some of the comments that have been made regarding Micro Focus investment and commitment to the product line. I have always been direct and honest with customers and partners on direction of the products. Some of the comments that have been appearing are mis-informed, inaccurate and borderline malicious in intent. They are not constructive and not the intent of the Ideas forum that is meant to discuss future enhancements.
I will point to the investments we have made in GroupWise that directly demonstrate commitment to GroupWise and further advancement. We have increased our release cadence of the GroupWise product lines. With that release cadence we are introducing new features more rapidly, vs waiting for each major release for new features. We have engaged customers via the Ideas forum and direct interviews to prioritize those features. We are releasing "Wasatch" version of GroupWise that will carry a new lifecycle - demonstrating on going commitment. We are introducing a new product in "Uinta" with tight integration into GroupWise. We also just acquired GWAVA to be able to advance GroupWise and offer a complete set of solutions directly from Micro Focus. I believe these activities directly demonstrate commitment and investment in the GroupWise product line.
Its fair to say you would have rather Micro Focus invested in area B over area A, its untrue to say Micro Focus isn't invested.
Thank You
Mike Bills
Product Line Manager - Collaboration
We would also like a new Linux client. The current carddav and calldav gives us some options to use any mail client on Linux but the busy search is still an issue. A client or a kind of alternative would be great.
Ubuntu has just dumped Unity and is going back to Gnome; there is one less Desktop we need a GroupWise client for.
Considering a lot of comments are about "working offline", with regards to a Linux Client, there is the option for browser based caching (aka. offline), which Office 365 offers for a limited number of mailbox folders. This could be easier to implement and would have a wider benefit for the product.
I've just tried to install the latest 'gw14.2.2_client_win' in Wine (2.13) but got an error message while it was installing: "err:rpc:rpcrt4_protseq_np_wait_for_new_connection wait failed with error 87"
It would be great to run in Wine environment.
**openSUSE LEAP 42.3
You should try the latest GroupWise Wasatch (Beta) Client - there is no MAPI dependency any more.
This is one of the reasons I believe it was a huge mistake to not develop a native Linux (and Mac if you like) client. MF has not been able to build an ecosystem around a platform that they (today) own. The result is customers are moving on. Everyone can see who owns a messaging system and an office system is key to the desktop. MS has proven this over and over. GroupWise at best should have been open sourced with SUSE long ago and loosly integrated with LibreOffice as Outlook is with MS office.
In German:
https://www.heise.de/amp/meldung/Linux-Aus-Niedersachsen-will-knapp-13-000-Rechner-auf-Windows-umstellen-4119380.html?__twitter_impression=true
I agree!
Hiri could be a good start as a new GroupWise cross platform client
https://www.hiri.com/
The Groupware-Client Evolution used to have a HW/SOAP Plugin long time ago. Why not update the code to make it compatible with current Evolution version https://github.com/GNOME/evolution-groupwise?files=1
I agree on the proposition of making the Evolution plugin available again for GroupWise.
With Linux apps now available on Chromebooks I feel that this makes a very strong case for a multi-platform GroupWise Client.
So many schools are now migrating to Chromebooks and Gsuite along with it. Micro Focus need to be able to give them a reason to stay with GroupWise. A full featured client is essential to give GroupWise any chance of survival in these schools.
From LATAM we urgently need to have some alternative as a client for Linux and MAC!.
Our customers claim to be able to have a solution similar to those that already exist, eg MailSpring or Zimbra Desktop.
We are losing new customers and existing customers.
Thank you very much team!
Again and again, we need a native GroupWise Linux client.......
It's a pity, that the latest offical reply on the urgent demand for a native Linux client, or at least an option to get the windows client running via wine, is about one year in the past. That gives me the impression, that this issue is not considered seriously! What the heck is the benefit of investing in a bunch of new features, while loosing customers, due to the fact that they are left alone with version 8(!)? To me, the question arises "what would be the effort, to get win version running via crossover, compared to the losses of customers and bad publicity" - I mean, to be objective and reflective, could someone give some measures for this ($, €, ...)? I fully understand, that the parallel development of several platforms/clients is uneconomical... on the other hand, with todays possibilities in software technology - other companies provide excellent examples (!) - it should be possible to realize a mordern groupware system with a native client for all platforms running... especially if we talk about a product like a groupware system, which is, IMHO, not necessarily linked to windows alone, but rather instrinsicaly a cross platform business!
However, I'm afraid, that we will have to wait for another couple of months/years/... to get the next dissapointing reply!? Please, persuade me otherwise!
Cheers!
As we only need MS Windows Clients on many machine just because of the native GW Client we urgently do need this piece of software, and it does not need to be approved for all kind of linux flavours out there just do support the few major ones and hope for the best for the rest and don't think of wine or webaccess.
AGREE - AGREE - AGREE
VISION ? - VISION ? VISION ?
We need a fully featured Linux desktop client. That's a fact. Everybody knows that. The only way to give the product management resources development is to vote for this idea. Please get others to vote for this.
Okay ... 244 votes sofar. That's a lot of votes one would say.
What has happened sofar at MF? They build a new webaccess GUI, which is a good start and looking better that the old one. Is it complete yet .. no .. but it's a good start.
Did they improve the desktop GUI so it's more of this day and age? No.
Will they create a fully featured Linux desktop client? Most likely not.
What does GroupWise need? A partnership with another eco system! If it wants to stay alive, it really needs to partner with an open source solution that is growing right now by the minute! A system like NextCloud. NextCloud is growing really fast and users are loving it. However, it lacks a mailing (or groupware) system.
Again ... 244 votes and did we reach a solution sofar? No (apart from the new webaccess GUI and the Native Access solution for Mac users).
You really want to change things around? Maybe this idea (allthough 299 votes sofar) is dying too ...
There are a couple of new ideas out there. Ideas for better partnerships with other solutions. Ideas like these:
https://ideas.microfocus.com/MFI/mf-gw/Idea/Detail/15259
https://www1.v1ideas.com/MFI/mf-gw/Idea/Detail/15260
These ideas are new, fresh and looking for support.
My suggestion; vote for these ideas and turn MF's attention to them. Hopefully something good will come from it and MF will finally see that something needs to change in order to keep GroupWise alive!!
THIS IDEA HAS BEEN MOVED OVER TO THE NEW IDEA SYSTEM, PLEASE MAKE YOUR VOTE THERE AGAIN IF YOU ARE STILL INTERESTED IN THIS SOLUTION, THX!
https://community.microfocus.com/t5/GroupWise-Idea-Exchange/Fully-featured-Linux-desktop-client/idi-p/2703105
While we're on it: after carefull consideration I believe it's not a viable idea to create a cross-platform GroupWise client based on the current Windows client codebase and (visual) concept. A new GroupWise-client to succeed it should imo be part of an ecosystem, so for those interested the new idea portal link is here to vote on. Added concept description here too.
https://community.microfocus.com/t5/GroupWise-Idea-Exchange/Why-it-makes-sense-for-GroupWise-to-build-a-new-client-as-part/idi-p/2743232
In this competitive world of email systems the one that owns the ecosystem owns the users. Obviously moving to Exchange/O365 (or Google systems for that matter) makes sense if you are a Microsoft Office dependant company as of course Outlook is an integrated part of that system. As the GroupWise client is not only visually but also from an integrations standpoint lacking in such ecosystem, moving to Exchange means moving off from any MF solution. In closed systems there is near no room left for competitors, nor for choise.
As there are a lot of (hosted/onprem) email solutions to choose from, how can GroupWise stay relevant? GroupWise would need an Office-like ecosystem around in which an end user feels comfortable. LibreOffice can provide such and could brings a rich MS Office/Google like expirience once settled.
Once we get over the idea to leave the current GroupWise Windows client for what it is and start over based on a framework of a well established (Libre)Office suite I believe this brings what it takes to get GroupWise back as an alternative for current competitors. Sure others could and would provit too from such developments, but having something to choose from does also benfit GroupWise and the Enterprise Messaging Suite (EMS) it's part of. It's obvious LibreOffice is and open source project, so there has to be worked with that community to get this done. The Office part is the most important piece missing in GroupWise and the EMS, but as we already started integrating LibreOffice Online by adding the Secure Content Editor Appliance (which is provided by Collabora Online(COOL)) to TeamWorks and Filr so the first pieces are already there. As LibreOffice is running on Mac/Win/Lin that would secure a cross platform client solution for the long term and honoring the higest voted requests for non-Windows support;
https://community.microfocus.com/t5/GroupWise-Idea-Exchange/Fully-featured-Mac-desktop-client/idi-p/2703104
https://community.microfocus.com/t5/GroupWise-Idea-Exchange/Fully-featured-Linux-desktop-client/idi-p/2703105
Trackback to the old idea portal where either scored ~300 and ~250 votes
https://www1.v1ideas.com/MFI/mf-gw/Idea/Detail/320
https://www1.v1ideas.com/MFI/mf-gw/Idea/Detail/321
Tough on short term it would take quite some time to develop, I would expect long term that get's less as with LibreOffice more developing partners will maintain the new code at least making sure that what is there is stable and well tested by a huge community. This stable base should be good enough to create enterprise supported clients from for Micro Focus to distribute as part of their GroupWise and EMS solution. As mentioned the COOL solution is already a partnership currently, so could the new client be a part in their long term supported Collabora Office for governments and companies. In the EMS this would complement working off- and online, on any device and leveraging open standards. This collaboration eco-system can be managed by ZENworks and secured by NetIQ solutions which gives MF a way to provide a full ecosystem again.
So, how would this work:
* Start with a new module in LibreOffice called "Contact", complementing Writer/Calc/Impress/etc. Contact-management is the centerpiece of a solution (opinion), this allows accessing, syncing and managing contact information which then can be used in any module for sharing, communication/interacting and as a part of document merges. In the LO Online version the Contact-API allows you to access your contacts from within any module so you can do document merges easily in Online-mode too.
* The Contact module has multiple tab's allowing access to email, calendar, tasks, notes, message(r)s, etc. This is the part that is not much different from what we are used to in the GroupWise Client today. This is the part that is all open source and for that could be used to add multiple tab's of each to be able to access multiple systems at the same time, which could be multiple GroupWise mailboxes or any POP/IMAP or online accounts a user has, well depending on modules privides by Micro Focus and other developing partners and/or the community. Depending how the plugin-infra is setup MF could obviously choose to create closed plugin's and leave other (IMAP, NNTP etc) plugin's up to the community, but my idea is to have a more open and common infra for email, calendar, task which supports the end-users common expirience that will offer. Tough open source plugins could still offer a calendar for like GroupWise which has multi user options embedded and a more simple calendar plug for other purposes. Having a more open infra allows for expermiments by the community.
* The Contact module's core should have a plugin that carries the hart of access to GroupWise (GroupWise client protocol) and should run on any platform. Depending on how it's developed it could be either open or closed source, think we prefer to open it up so it can be build as part of the solution, or only as part of the MF provided binaries. Maybe something with on- and offine mode needs to be part of this in case we want offine mode to be a part of the GroupWise access plugin. From a cross platform perspective I would suggest to leverage the default LO Database, but that could also be GroupWise's (wasn't that use dby eDirectory today and open sourced a while back? It at least runs on all targetted platforms).
* We need a plugin infra for 3th parties so they can ty into the solution, but this could also be leveraged for Micro Focus provided solutions like Vibe/Filr/Retain/SMG etc plugin's. There's a host of 3th parties providing language correction solutions, access to CRM's, etc.
This may not be all, but at least the centerpiece of the idea.
please vote at the new ideas portal at : https://community.microfocus.com/t5/GroupWise-Idea-Exchange/Fully-featured-Linux-desktop-client/idi-p/2703105
Does someone @MicroFocus ever read this??
Until last update it was still possible to use the (old) GW8 Linux client - not really good, ut was able to use most of the features.
Since 18.2.0 the 8.0 client can't connect anymore.
Webaccess is full of bugs - other frontends (evolution for ex.) do not work properly with calendar- rule- proxy- and other functions? I could throw away my Windows computer - I found a Linux replacement for all needed tasks at my administration desk - but not for my "linux based" eMail program Groupwise?!